S2E15: 7 Pro Tips for a Successful Campus Visit
Summary: It’s campus visit season. Jeff and Laurie discuss the parts of a college visit you don’t want to leave campus without, especially if you’re looking for a biblically based Christian community. Don’t miss these 7 pro tips!
S2E15: 7 Pro Tips for a Successful Campus Visit
[00:00:11.08] - Jeff Sherrod
Hey, everyone, and welcome back to college conversations. This is the podcast about all things related to christian higher education. This podcast is for prospective students and parents, for people that are just interested in some of the trends related to christian higher education. We try to do a lot of things in this podcast. Sometimes we talk about specific things that you're gonna face when you come to colleges. Expectations. Sometimes we talk about the theological significance of taking on a biblical education. So lots of themes related to christian higher education at large. I'm here today with a regular guest, Miss Laurie Kagay. Laurie is the vice president of marketing enrollment at the Institute for God. My name is Jeff Sherrod. Yeah. So we're always happy to be here with you guys, to be able to hang out and to talk. We don't have Gregg today with us. So you got some words?
[00:01:02.42] - Laurie Kagay
We miss him.
[00:01:03.04] - Jeff Sherrod
We do. We miss him. He's actually in Africa right now with some other people. So we do a lot of work as a school and an organization internationally. So we have students that are even there in Africa that take classes online.
[00:01:15.43] - Laurie Kagay
Yep.
[00:01:16.06] - Jeff Sherrod
But we have a lot of our students that are traveling. What percentage of the students would you say are traveling this summer?
[00:01:23.15] - Laurie Kagay
I think I can think of two that aren't.
[00:01:25.32] - Jeff Sherrod
Okay. Right. The grand majority of students are traveling internationally this summer. So that's pretty cool. And so Gregg's actually headed to Africa to help set up some things for summer internship. Summer internship is a trip that students take either before they come here or right after they come here and kind of exposes them to some of the issues that our students face in the developing world and then how to understand those things and address them through a biblical lens. So, yeah, we wish him the best, and we've been praying for him, and, yeah, I miss him today. Yeah. So in this podcast, what we're looking at, Laurie, I think that one of the reasons you're a great guest to have on the show, it's one of the reasons we have you here. But also, like, I think even the nature of the show, we're addressing this to prospective students and their parents. I mean, this is an area of expertise for you. You do a lot of tours, you talk to a lot of prospective students.
[00:02:20.83] - Laurie Kagay
So many.
[00:02:21.80] - Jeff Sherrod
You have a lot of Zoom calls with students. So I think it's nice. Cause I do think that you kind of have your pulse. You have a pulse on. What's the phrase?
[00:02:30.05] - Laurie Kagay
A pulse? I think.
[00:02:31.59] - Jeff Sherrod
I don't know. I'm not sure. That doesn't sound right. A thumb on the pulse is what Chris is telling us. I think that sounds also marginally correct, but, yeah, maybe you have a thumb on the pulse.
[00:02:41.74] - Laurie Kagay
Finger on the pulse.
[00:02:42.93] - Jeff Sherrod
Finger on the pulse. I don't know, guys. There's some kind of beat that you have for what's happening in Christianity education, christian higher education, not just what's happening there, but what prospective students are facing, what kind of questions they go after. In this podcast we're talking about, like, an effective college visit. This is something that we promote on our side. We definitely think that students, if they're able to, should be able to take trips and visit the colleges that they want to go to. It hugely helps. But you've done lots. You've hosted lots of these trips. So you kind of get a sense of what kind of questions students ask. What is a successful. By the time it's done, man, that was a good time. Or sometimes even if it's not successful on their end, we're going to be like, hey, you didn't ask this question, but you should have asked. We're going to supply sometimes the question that they should have asked. So, yeah, that's kind of what we're kind of getting in today. Like I said, you have a ton of experience with this. I don't know how many tours you've done.
[00:03:44.53] - Laurie Kagay
The importance of campus visits.
[00:03:46.50] - Jeff Sherrod
The importance of campus visits. I think also, like, what makes a good campus visit?
[00:03:51.96] - Laurie Kagay
Okay. What do you not want to leave campus without?
[00:03:54.28] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah, that's a great way of saying it. Like, what, what do you, what do you, by the time that you walk off the campus, what are all the things that you should have done and asked about?
[00:04:02.43] - Laurie Kagay
All right.
[00:04:02.97] - Jeff Sherrod
So kind of setting up some kind of rubric.
[00:04:04.46] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah, yeah. And I think there are. It's good for everyone to know. There's, there's various types of campus visits. Yeah. That we offer. That most colleges offer. I would say most colleges anymore have some sort of virtual tour available for you. So those are the, you know, those are already readily accessible on their website. I would encourage you to watch them. There is a great resource in the college tour. They do, you know, 30 minutes college episode.
[00:04:27.01] - Jeff Sherrod
Yep.
[00:04:27.75] - Laurie Kagay
I know my nieces were visiting colleges, and my sister is just like, let's fly here. Let's fly there. I'm like, you know, you can watch the tv show first. Like, just like.
[00:04:36.18] - Jeff Sherrod
So you're saying even if they're gonna go there in person, like, just starting with sometimes, like the virtual tour or.
[00:04:43.50] - Laurie Kagay
Just on the financial level, I'm like, just make sure you like the 30 minutes.
[00:04:47.24] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah. Right.
[00:04:47.66] - Laurie Kagay
Then book the ticket. But yeah, even for people visiting the institute, I often tell them, just go watch the episode first with your family. It'll kind of give you a context for who we are, you know? Then you're not like, we've been featured.
[00:05:00.06] - Jeff Sherrod
On the college tour. So.
[00:05:00.81] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah, we're actually. I'm pretty sure we're the only still bible college on the college tour. So we are in season ten, episode two, if you want to check us out. But most colleges will have at least some aspect of a tour on their website. Yeah, the website itself should be guided to help you understand the college. But walking on it, you know, meeting people, all those things are different.
[00:05:22.20] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:05:23.69] - Laurie Kagay
Colleges often have, like, visit days or preview days.
[00:05:26.86] - Jeff Sherrod
Right.
[00:05:27.43] - Laurie Kagay
Those are great. Especially if you want to meet not just the people at the campus, but the other people looking at that college.
[00:05:34.12] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:05:34.61] - Laurie Kagay
So I know I had experiences like that as a student. And I also know our current students made a very good friend. You know, just when they came to preview day and they were able to anticipate all those marks of moving to campus with a. With a friend who is feeling like they are. But then there's also like, sometimes the preview days don't work out for you or your schedule. I've had people come just pass through and get a tour because they're like, we're passing through Nashville. Just stop for a quick visit. That happened last week. I think you asked me how many tours I give. I don't know.
[00:06:07.16] - Jeff Sherrod
I mean, how many this week?
[00:06:08.83] - Laurie Kagay
This week? I just came from one right now.
[00:06:11.36] - Jeff Sherrod
Right this second.
[00:06:11.97] - Laurie Kagay
So, I mean, I think in the last seven days, it's been like, I'm at six.
[00:06:16.19] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah. And I'm like, a little bit load with someone else. Not me, with you, someone else on me.
[00:06:22.47] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah.
[00:06:23.27] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:06:23.68] - Laurie Kagay
Anyway.
[00:06:24.63] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah, so I think that you bring up a good point. So sometimes when we think about a college visit, we're really thinking, like, I'm getting in the car with my mom and we're gonna go always with the mom.
[00:06:33.61] - Laurie Kagay
I mean, yeah, sometimes we do see.
[00:06:35.68] - Jeff Sherrod
More dads than we used to.
[00:06:37.25] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah, it's true.
[00:06:38.87] - Jeff Sherrod
For a while it was just the kid and the mom, but, you know, get in the car. Station wagon, as it were. Right. And getting. And visit the college. But I think that you're bringing up a good point. Like, there's a lot of different ways to tour the college. And for those that are. I'm using like, air quotes. Yeah. So, like, what would you say? Like, you're kind of bring up the easiest one, which is lowest stakes. Go do a virtual tour.
[00:07:00.68] - Laurie Kagay
Right.
[00:07:01.05] - Jeff Sherrod
And. Or watch if it's on the college tour, watch that. Visit the website. That's the easiest one.
[00:07:05.86] - Laurie Kagay
That's the easiest one. Another one we do is a zoom call.
[00:07:09.48] - Jeff Sherrod
Okay. Right.
[00:07:10.13] - Laurie Kagay
Typically, with a staff member, it's still cheaper than, you know, gas money, airplane, anything. But I do. I personally enjoy getting to know a student and their families on Zoom offers a platform. I can, you know, you can only see someone's face. I can show you pictures. I can kind of do a tour via zoom.
[00:07:28.75] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:07:29.23] - Laurie Kagay
For you live that addresses your specific, specific questions, not just the one that's on tv. So that's also a great first step. But if you. I think everyone's still curious and you.
[00:07:40.35] - Jeff Sherrod
Like, about what percentage of students that you think come and do a tour, you've already done some kind of zoom call with them.
[00:07:47.97] - Laurie Kagay
Most.
[00:07:48.52] - Jeff Sherrod
Most. Okay. Yeah. So most people are kind of working through. I'm watching something. I'm gonna do a zoom, and then.
[00:07:54.49] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah. Anymore, they actually say, like, students want to be accepted first, then they'll come visit. It's. Whereas, like, I know when I was going to college, it was like, well, let me visit everything, and then decide where I want to go. Right. You know, decide where I want to fill my application, do the essay and all that. I think applications have become so kind of streamlined for people.
[00:08:13.02] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:08:13.45] - Laurie Kagay
Or they're like, no offense, Gen Z, but sometimes they're like, a little self sabotage, so they're like, I probably won't get in, so I'm not going to visit it. Yeah. Get my hopes up until I know that I'm accepted.
[00:08:26.43] - Jeff Sherrod
And you would say, we've seen that same kind of trend, like, most of the tours, that we get accepted students now.
[00:08:31.04] - Laurie Kagay
Most of the time. Sometimes it's kind of one extreme or the other. I feel like they're accepted. Or they might be like, a sophomore, junior who's just, like, ahead of the game.
[00:08:38.03] - Jeff Sherrod
Right. Okay.
[00:08:38.99] - Laurie Kagay
Because we open up our apps, like, the year before.
[00:08:41.17] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:08:41.47] - Laurie Kagay
You know, so, yeah, one or the two. One or two of those. I do recommend all those things. If I. If we have an applicant at the institute and I haven't done a Zoom call with them or they haven't met some member of our staff, I'm like, who knows? You know? Like, I feel like that's a first level, you know, step of really investigating.
[00:08:59.16] - Jeff Sherrod
A situation, and they're fun. I've been on some of these zoom calls, too. You get to meet people sometimes you have the dad who actually was there the whole time, and then. But he wasn't in the frame anyway.
[00:09:07.45] - Laurie Kagay
Oh, that's my favorite. It actually happens often. Like, the baron is out of frame.
[00:09:13.94] - Jeff Sherrod
And I see, like, a forehead, and.
[00:09:17.19] - Laurie Kagay
It'S always fun because they. You can tell, actually, you made them feel more comfortable.
[00:09:20.86] - Jeff Sherrod
Right, right. They're, like, slowly coming in. Yeah.
[00:09:23.16] - Laurie Kagay
One of my favorites was this dad who, by the end of the zoom call, was, like, going and gathering his daughter's artwork to, like, show me, like. And I was like, this is awesome. So, yeah, I just. Yeah, so it's like, if your schedule is busy or you're like, I don't know when I can get to such and such location or finances or anything like that. You know? Zoom is like. Cause again, a campus video is great zoom, but it allows you to talk to a person.
[00:09:53.60] - Jeff Sherrod
Right? Yes. Specific questions for your context. Okay, so let's say that they've done the. They've watched a video or done a virtual tour, or they've done a Zoom call. Now there's, like, now there's some expense. They're gonna, like, get on a plane or get in a car and come visit campus. This is risky for everybody. Right. There's always some nerves with this. You mentioned two types of visits. Sometimes it's a real organized visit, like a campus preview day, and a lot of people come, or it's kind of like, come and do your own thing. What do you think are some of the pros and cons of one or the other?
[00:10:23.30] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah. So I brought up one pro already with a preview day is, like, you get to meet other people who are also interested in the school, and you're kind of in the same stage of the.
[00:10:30.58] - Jeff Sherrod
Might be entering in with. Okay.
[00:10:32.94] - Laurie Kagay
People are like. They end up being like, I had so much fun with you that day. Do you want to be roommates this year? And, you know, putting it on their little request form.
[00:10:40.45] - Jeff Sherrod
And we've seen that happen, too. I met this person. Can we be roommates this cute?
[00:10:43.77] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah. And I think that is maybe even the premier benefit of coming on, like, a preview day.
[00:10:49.88] - Jeff Sherrod
Right.
[00:10:50.53] - Laurie Kagay
Another thing is, you're coming alongside other families who. Who are just at the same stage of the process with you. Yeah. So, usually, if it's a day like that, like, for me as a planner, I'm gonna make sure almost every one of our staff members is available that day.
[00:11:04.30] - Jeff Sherrod
Right.
[00:11:04.66] - Laurie Kagay
So, you know, I'm not gonna usually plan a preview day where our president's not. You know, he's traveling, and this is.
[00:11:11.87] - Jeff Sherrod
Gonna be a risk of, like, an individual visit. There might just be some staff there where.
[00:11:15.13] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah, then there's an individual visit. The pro is. It's. You get to book it on your time. Yeah, but sometimes, you know, students are like, well, this day works for me. I'm like, okay, well, that is a Saturday. So the campus will be kind of empty, you know, if that is fine with you. But at the same time, there's a pro to that. If you just want to, like, see what a Saturday looks like on campus and, like, kind of have a no frills thing, we will do our best, at least on our campus, to, like, accommodate you, be as hospitable as we can within those constraints. But, yeah, like, you may not get to sit on a class if you just pick a random day on the calendar.
[00:11:50.10] - Jeff Sherrod
Right.
[00:11:50.46] - Laurie Kagay
You know, our classes are done a week and a half from now, so where you're gonna kind of be limited on, I want to go to chapel or I want to go to a class. You might not be able to get each of those experiences if you're picking the date, but you may have a very individualized scenario in a different way. We have a student here this week on an individual visit. He's an athlete. He loves playing soccer. We're like, all right, pickup game on the field at 06:00. And, you know, everyone came out and played, and I heard that he was like, that was so fun. Like, he was like, I even fell. But everyone, like, help me get up. And, you know, just, like, different aspects of that experience spoke to him.
[00:12:31.12] - Jeff Sherrod
Right.
[00:12:31.90] - Laurie Kagay
Because we knew he loved soccer, and he's here this week.
[00:12:35.58] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah, we like soccer, too, so, yeah.
[00:12:37.49] - Laurie Kagay
Another girl, like, had, you know, extreme gluten free allergies, and we took her. There's a gluten free dairy or gluten free bakery down the street. Her and her mom were like, I mean, that bakery may have sealed the deal for that family. They were so happy.
[00:12:53.96] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:12:54.78] - Laurie Kagay
Because they're like, this is, you know, five minutes from campus, and you thought about us enough to take us there. I'm like, yeah, of course we did. So the individualized support is, you know, is great.
[00:13:06.61] - Jeff Sherrod
I imagine, too, like, some students might think that you're getting a more realistic view if you come outside of a preview day. Like, I can say, I don't know if that's true or not, but at least at, like, where I went to college, if I walked into the student daddy room and there was, like, the nicest lunch, I would be like, oh, oh, it's preview day. You know, you kind of knew, like, this was a, this was.
[00:13:27.34] - Laurie Kagay
So tell them. You've told me this story a couple times, but I like it. Tell them about the fireplace room.
[00:13:31.49] - Jeff Sherrod
Okay.
[00:13:31.87] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah.
[00:13:32.12] - Jeff Sherrod
So we had. I went to the college I went to was in Chicago. And we, I went on this tour initially, got on the station with my mom, and then I went to visit this college. So we had a student that kind of brought us around. You know, like, here's the places. Here's the thing. And like, one of the rooms that I loved was they like, it was a snowy day in Chicago, so it's already had that kind of vibe going on. And so I walk in and it's like this room that has this central fireplace with nice wing back chairs and kind of like leather chairs in the corners with little reading nooks. And it's floor to ceiling books on the walls. And then a floor to ceiling window facing outward. And it was snowing. And I was like, I want to live.
[00:14:12.83] - Laurie Kagay
I want to live in this room right here.
[00:14:14.02] - Jeff Sherrod
So I ended up going to college here. And I think that that might have been the room that stood out to me the most. And it wasn't until I graduated that I realized I actually never went into that room again.
[00:14:23.89] - Laurie Kagay
Never.
[00:14:24.42] - Jeff Sherrod
That was it. No, I never went because there was. I don't know if actually the books were fake even like, looking back on it. Or maybe it was like a law set. You know how some of those are like. Or they were so old, but it wasn't part of the library. It was a reading room.
[00:14:38.36] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah, that.
[00:14:39.66] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah. It just wasn't in a building that had. I was never in this building. It was the administration building. So it's just. Yeah, I just never might have been.
[00:14:46.57] - Laurie Kagay
For their professors or something.
[00:14:48.23] - Jeff Sherrod
I think it was for like, uh, when they were doing like, photo shoots or something like that. That was my sense.
[00:14:53.79] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah. So that's, that's maybe I don't know where to go from there. Yeah. Like, but that's true. You probably have a nicer meal on preview day because you want them to see what you can do, right?
[00:15:06.33] - Jeff Sherrod
And you want to believe that the school's not showing you the fireplace room. Like, this is where you're gonna live. Actually. You want to, you want to hope it's right. It's been real. Yeah.
[00:15:14.28] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah. We're not trying to be fake by any means. We're not. Yeah. But anyway, so, yeah, maybe a mural, moralistic take. But sometimes it may just be a logistical problem. Like, you come in the summer. We're a missions college. I just said 95% of our people might be around the world.
[00:15:32.00] - Jeff Sherrod
Right?
[00:15:32.34] - Laurie Kagay
You're gonna be like, well, this is a dead campus. No, it's July, and they're in India, Uganda, El Salvador. Like, so that's not, you know, real. It's just a part of the calendar year that didn't line up exactly with what you're considering. So.
[00:15:48.01] - Jeff Sherrod
So, yeah, pros and cons, both ways. I think that if students are able to do a preview day, you should do that. That's a way. But if you can't do that, for whatever reason, still try to come before you come. Okay, so let's talk about. Let's say they're here now, right? Okay. What would you say? Let's. Let's see if we can do it. Like, if students. We're trying to help students to get, like, by the time you leave campus, don't leave without. What would you say, number one point? Number one.
[00:16:11.59] - Laurie Kagay
Can I just say, like, as they come to me, not like this is the most important.
[00:16:14.71] - Jeff Sherrod
Sure, yeah. Yeah.
[00:16:15.45] - Laurie Kagay
Okay.
[00:16:15.76] - Jeff Sherrod
In no particular order.
[00:16:17.04] - Laurie Kagay
In no particular order, I would say you gotta see the dorms.
[00:16:20.04] - Jeff Sherrod
Okay.
[00:16:20.60] - Laurie Kagay
Like, that is where you are gonna live. So, I mean, even on my tours, I'm like, okay, this is the closet. This is how much room you're gonna have. Those are, like, actually, the questions that a lot of questions stem from. But sometimes people don't actually show you those things.
[00:16:35.74] - Jeff Sherrod
Right?
[00:16:36.35] - Laurie Kagay
I know. I know. The moms especially, they, like, show me the laundry. Where is it? You know, how often? But those are the practical concerns. And I would. Yeah, I would say look at the door.
[00:16:50.00] - Jeff Sherrod
It's important. I think. I think that's a good point. Like, it's important that students can envision, like, where they will be when they're thinking about their college experience.
[00:16:58.51] - Laurie Kagay
You're not living life in the classroom. You're going to the classroom a couple times a week, but, like, you're sleeping in this space every night while you're hanging out there with your friends. What kind of. What kind of space is it? And, you know, maybe it, like, for our. Our dorms here on campus, they're all houses, so they have morning prayer in them. They cook full meals in them. You know, it really is a communal living experience. That's. Yeah, it's a house. It's not cinder block. There's not, you know, just a microwave. Like, it's a full bodied experience.
[00:17:30.18] - Jeff Sherrod
But we also. We also, I think, try to not even try. We do. We show real rooms. This is another room. Well, this is another thing. On the same college tour, we went into, like, a fake room, and they're like, this is how the rooms are set up, and. But no one lived in there. It was like a. Yeah, it was like a gas. I think it was a guest room. I don't know what it was.
[00:17:47.52] - Laurie Kagay
They probably had, like, an extra room.
[00:17:48.93] - Jeff Sherrod
It looked awesome and super clean, but it wasn't real. No one. There was no students that lived there. It was where they've. Maybe. And maybe it was practical. Let's give them the benefit of the doubt. Maybe, like, we don't want to disrupt students in their living quarters all the time, so we're gonna do fake room to show you what it would be like if you did live here.
[00:18:07.45] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah, maybe. Yeah, maybe.
[00:18:08.66] - Jeff Sherrod
That's a generous.
[00:18:09.28] - Laurie Kagay
It's also letting us know they have extra rooms.
[00:18:11.48] - Jeff Sherrod
Good for you.
[00:18:12.41] - Laurie Kagay
Good for you. Yeah, for us. I like showing actual student rooms because I think that helps even students envision. Hey, yeah, I can decorate it. I can make it my flavor and my, you know, art. The girls rooms, especially, are very cute.
[00:18:27.32] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah, they are.
[00:18:27.92] - Laurie Kagay
But even the guys try. You know, they do try.
[00:18:31.39] - Jeff Sherrod
I think.
[00:18:33.02] - Laurie Kagay
I think that's, you know, another look. Like, how do the dorms work? What rules exist here? You know, how many people can be in and out? And how does that work? I think it's just a practical concern. But if you don't see that while you're on campus, you're gonna drive away from campus, be like, I wonder about, right. Storage.
[00:18:50.22] - Jeff Sherrod
And then it's like, what should I bring and who? Yeah, there's a lot of questions that you're gonna.
[00:18:55.08] - Laurie Kagay
Sometimes it's funny because yourself and I will be on Zoom calls, and we're like, can we explain the program? Maybe the majors? And it's like, do I get a parking pass? You know, it's like, sometimes those are the questions. Like, where am I gonna park? Or am I gonna do my laundry? So, yeah, I mean, just make sure you check.
[00:19:09.26] - Jeff Sherrod
Is it a quarter laundry or is it free laundry? These are the questions that we're getting, people.
[00:19:13.10] - Laurie Kagay
Okay, what about you? What's your question?
[00:19:13.95] - Jeff Sherrod
Okay, so I think that it's important that there are. Do you think that there's importance that there's times where the student is apart from the parent? But I do think that it's important that there's a moment when I, the student and the parent, the child and the parent are able to have a meeting with someone on staff, like, together. And I think the reason that's important is that students and parents have very different concerns. So, like, sometimes when I'm talking to the potential student or someone who's accepted, they're thinking about, like, you know, where am I gonna be? Like, what's this gonna do for me down the road? And how's this gonna work out? It's a lot of, like, vocation oriented type questions, maybe practical questions, or they have no questions at all. This is often what I find. And then the parent will be like, all right, what does it cost? And the kind of practical questions that we brought up, sometimes it has worked out where that hasn't happened, and then that student will call us back. And, like, I went home, we had a great visit, but my mom has so many questions.
[00:20:14.79] - Laurie Kagay
Can we do a zoom call?
[00:20:15.66] - Jeff Sherrod
Can we do a zoom call? Yeah, right? And I'm like, so if you're there on campus already and you're together, I'd say try to find a time where both you guys can hear questions. And so both parent and the student can kind of talk to someone on staff and say, what about this and what's happening? I think it's also good for the student to hear, like, what their parent is concerned about. Oh, that is a good question.
[00:20:38.08] - Laurie Kagay
Go back to your point, though. Cause you also said you think it's good when the student has time, kind of just being a student. So why do you think that or what?
[00:20:46.16] - Jeff Sherrod
Well, because we want, again, students to envision what it's like to be on campus, and they're not gonna be here with your dad or your mom, sorry to say. And we love your mom and dad, but they're just not gonna live with you here. So there actually has been times that we've had to tell parents, like, hey, so they're gonna be.
[00:21:04.20] - Laurie Kagay
They're gonna go to class on their own.
[00:21:06.04] - Jeff Sherrod
They're like, I can't come. It's not that you can't come. We're trying to give them, like, a more realistic experience, and they can do that and have a little bit better social interaction. If their mom's not, like, over their shoulder, it'd be like, oh, who's this? Introduce me, you know? And that's cute. And we like that moments. And we try to facilitate, at least for us, we try to facilitate times where both these things happen.
[00:21:29.07] - Laurie Kagay
Right.
[00:21:29.63] - Jeff Sherrod
But it is important that I think that the student has some time, some social time, even to be able to hang out with students, see what's saying. You're gonna get kind of like the real deal, the scoop into what student life is. Like if your mom or your dad's not there with you.
[00:21:45.96] - Laurie Kagay
Right. I agree. And that's why mom and dad, sometimes we're like, this is a session just for students.
[00:21:50.82] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah. Right.
[00:21:51.50] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah.
[00:21:51.78] - Jeff Sherrod
And we say that. Yeah. And it's like, we try to. I think people mostly get it.
[00:21:55.16] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah.
[00:21:55.53] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah. All right, well, what. What else would you say?
[00:21:57.92] - Laurie Kagay
Um, I think a time to engage the Lord with our current students. I think campuses have different kind of spiritual climates or even different spiritual practices. Like, I think question students are asking but may not know how to frame verbally, would be like, how comfortable am I going to feel in worship? Are we a place that raises our hands? Are we a place that prays out loud? Are we not? Is there pressure to do that? Is there not, like. So I think instead of just asking a staff member, how do you worship? Like, go engage in a worship experience with current students and see how you feel. Right. See what it's like. See the comfort level that you feel or. Yeah. I mean, I tell students looking at our school, like, if you don't like to worship and pray, it's probably not school for you. Our students are kind of a little addicted to that.
[00:22:56.63] - Jeff Sherrod
Do you think that it's. And I think my concern here would be if someone's like, well, I prefer, you know, whatever kind of flavor of worship they prefer, and then it becomes, like, real, like, consumeristic.
[00:23:08.92] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah.
[00:23:09.89] - Jeff Sherrod
Do you think that that's a concern?
[00:23:11.25] - Laurie Kagay
I think that's not. Sorry. Yeah, I would say that's a healthy concern. You don't necessarily just, like, want to.
[00:23:17.43] - Jeff Sherrod
Shop, because often the thing that we, like the best is just the thing we grew up with.
[00:23:21.93] - Laurie Kagay
That's true. Yeah. But I think noting, like, again, what I'm. I think what I'm trying to say is, like, noting a spiritual climate of a place and whether or not you. Maybe it's. Maybe it's not even the comfort level. Maybe it's. Did you, you know, feel the presence of God right moment? Like, college is a big decision. It's one you should make with the Lord and in prayer. And I think that campus experiences, particularly in christian colleges, bible colleges, should facilitate a moment like that. I think if we're doing our job right, that's not a manipulative moment to be like. And you should see the answer is us. It's a moment where you can seek the Lord.
[00:24:01.61] - Jeff Sherrod
Right.
[00:24:01.91] - Laurie Kagay
And I. And do that in a way that you feel him. I don't know if I'm phrasing that.
[00:24:09.97] - Jeff Sherrod
No, I think that you're right. I think that one. And I'll maybe go into one of my points. One of the things that I wanted to say is I don't think you should leave a campus visit without having unstructured time. But I think this actually relates because, yeah, we want chapel to be a time where we do sense God's presence, but we really want. When you walk around with current students, especially maybe not like freshmen, because, you know, they're learning and we're getting that. But like, when you're working on students that have been there for so many years and if you're not getting like the word coming out of their mouth, if you don't hear this like, attitude of dependence on God and a clear demonstration that they're, they're filling their mind with, with God's word and what's coming out of them is God's word, then I think that that also gives us insight into the spiritual climate. I agree, of the university, too, because I think that there's often very spiritual professors and spiritual life staff, but we want to make sure. I think that you should judge to see how much that translates.
[00:25:09.48] - Laurie Kagay
That's true.
[00:25:10.07] - Jeff Sherrod
Into the life of the.
[00:25:10.81] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah. And you really need both in that way. You need to see how it's facilitate how it is facilitated, whether that's a classroom time or a chapel time, but also how when it's not a formal time, does the spirituality continue? Is the word coming out of them?
[00:25:26.91] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah. Is the word coming out of them. And don't just like, use what can feel the easiest metrics. Like, I like how these people dress and I like how they use very high christian language. You know, it's like sometimes we get a little messed up with this. Like, Jesus wasn't. Jesus was a very spiritual person, although he didn't necessarily hold on to the signs of traditional spirituality. So it's important that, you know, we have our own sense of discernment that I think that, and maybe this is a tall task for prospective students, but I would encourage students to pray before they go and ask God to help them to discern, like man, this is a big deal. You want to feel like by the time you're going to christian college, this is going to grow you in your faith, not take away. One of the things that I've talked to a lot of people have gone to a lot of different christian colleges, and something I've noted in all of them is that there's a tendency for some students to, like, go for it and do real well, but there's a lot of students that by the time they graduate, they're real jaded. And if you see a lot of students that are real jaded, you know, I would pay attention to that, and it might give you some insight and be like, why is that happening? Why are they, like, real negative about this experience or negative about ministry or negative about whatever else? If you hear a lot of negativity, I would. That's something I would pay attention to.
[00:26:42.71] - Laurie Kagay
One of the compl. One of my favorite compliments I've heard from a visitor to campus, and this wasn't a student visitor. It was like a evaluator when they came via our accreditation process. But they also sat in on our chapel, and one of the visitors said, I've never seen so many heads up in a chapel.
[00:27:00.19] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:27:00.53] - Laurie Kagay
And I was like, what do you mean? He's like, they weren't looking at their phones, you know, they weren't slouched in their chairs.
[00:27:05.15] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:27:05.59] - Laurie Kagay
Like, I've never seen so many present students.
[00:27:09.57] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:27:10.06] - Laurie Kagay
At a chapel. And I was like, I love that. Makes me so happy.
[00:27:14.75] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:27:15.52] - Laurie Kagay
But, yeah. Like, paying attention.
[00:27:16.83] - Jeff Sherrod
Paying attention, that kind of stuff. Yeah. And at least going in, even if you're like, I'm just learning the Lord, I don't know if I can discern all that. Then ask God to help you.
[00:27:23.47] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah.
[00:27:23.79] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah. And he will. He'll give you some insight into what you're doing. It's like you really want this time to maximize your visit, which is short. People say, God, give me some insight in what's happening. And we're hoping that wherever you go, especially if it's like, you know, bible college, that's, you know, really teaching God's word, that you would sense God's spirit.
[00:27:41.89] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah.
[00:27:42.15] - Jeff Sherrod
In that place.
[00:27:42.50] - Laurie Kagay
I agree. Yeah, I agree.
[00:27:43.59] - Jeff Sherrod
Well, what else would you say? Don't leave campus unless you.
[00:27:47.04] - Laurie Kagay
I'm forgetting the other one I said earlier.
[00:27:49.04] - Jeff Sherrod
One of the things that you were saying is like, well, obviously you have to visit a class.
[00:27:52.08] - Laurie Kagay
Oh, yeah. So I think so. We kind of talk about spiritual climate. Some of that can come in a classroom, it can come in chapel. I do think it's. It's a good experience, especially if you're going to a Bible college. It's like, get the experience. College classrooms are very different from high school classrooms. I know. For us, we practice a flipped classroom model that takes some time to get used to. That means our students are not or our teachers are not just lecturing that's a very interactive experience. But, yeah, I think in visiting a class, you're getting to see also, another rubric would be the interaction between staff and students or between faculty and students. And I think that can tell you a lot. Is your one, like, does faculty good, do a good job in teaching? Are they, you know, handling the text well? Are they insightful? Is it a good time in class? You don't want to go to boring classes.
[00:28:47.19] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:28:49.06] - Laurie Kagay
But also, how do the students act in class can help you even know. Okay. What's expected.
[00:28:54.19] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:28:55.71] - Laurie Kagay
What's expected at our school is, like, a lot of interaction. We want you guys to feel free. We want you to be honest. We want there to be dialogical components. And I think sitting in that and kind of observing the interaction, again, between staff and students or faculty and students is very helpful for you to consider. Continue to make that consideration. How would I fit and what would be expected?
[00:29:18.05] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah, I think that's good. I think that, you know, traditionally, when we were probably doing college visits, that's what we. We would go. We would sit on as many classes as maybe we could, and that was more or less the visit and go to, like, a dining hall. Hall.
[00:29:29.76] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah.
[00:29:30.38] - Jeff Sherrod
And then. But I think more and more what we're seeing now is that students that is not at the top of their list, which I think is interesting.
[00:29:36.74] - Laurie Kagay
Right.
[00:29:37.14] - Jeff Sherrod
They're going to college, but it's like, well, I want to make sure I visit the dorm.
[00:29:39.53] - Laurie Kagay
What are the clubs and what are the friends.
[00:29:43.88] - Jeff Sherrod
Like? Oh, yeah, probably should go to that, too. You definitely should. It's like, you know, we. One of our slogans at the institute is that we're more than a school, but that we're also a school, and we've had to, like, amend that to be like, yeah, we're. We're doing more than education. Right. More than what's happening in classroom. There is a lot that's happening here.
[00:30:00.52] - Laurie Kagay
It's a christian community. This is a discipleship model. Like, there is a lot to this that is not solely the classroom, but still the classroom, and we're still teaching God's word, and it's serious, and it's.
[00:30:11.15] - Jeff Sherrod
A super important part of the thing. And just like we talked about spirituality, I don't think it's bad questions to put students on the spot. Like, if you're a visiting student or parent, just come up to a student after class. Like, what kind of things have you been learning in this class? What stood out to you?
[00:30:26.73] - Laurie Kagay
Right.
[00:30:27.00] - Jeff Sherrod
You know, like, in. They're like, I don't know. I can't remember anything.
[00:30:29.69] - Laurie Kagay
This is a big decision in your life. It's a big decision, like financial decision. It's, you're moving from everything you've ever known. Like, have the guts, ask some questions.
[00:30:38.15] - Jeff Sherrod
Right.
[00:30:38.92] - Laurie Kagay
The more you do that, the more you'll get out of a visit.
[00:30:41.21] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah, exactly. Right? Yeah, yeah, I think that. And we're talking about even, like you mentioned, the financial. That might be the last thing I would say is, don't leave. Don't leave a campus without figuring out cost. Like that would be. We actually have a student that's here, like you mentioned right now on a college visit. He was telling me yesterday, he's like, I went on a preview to another college in Pacific Northwest, and it was like a preview, kind of a two day preview event. And he was like, and the last session of the last day, they're like, all right, we're gonna talk about finances. And he was like, you know, by being on this visit, you get a $4,000 scholarship. So everyone's like, woohoo. And then he went into the meeting and found out that after scholarships, tuition was $60,000 a year. After scholarships. And that's not a room or board, that was tuition. So he was like, well, I wish they would have told me that on day one, but at least nothing else. They said it, right. So that's nice. And I think that that's important. So it doesn't. This is something we have to kind of. You have to. We try to work with students that sometimes understand scholarship, literacy. Maybe that's a way of saying it, because there can be one school that can give you $10,000 of scholarship, but if the school is $100,000 a year.
[00:31:50.98] - Laurie Kagay
This is still, which is happening these days.
[00:31:52.47] - Jeff Sherrod
This is happening, right? But they're like, but I got 10,000. But if you get a $10,000 scholarship at another school or $8,000 in another school, but the tuition is $20,000 a year, this is very different.
[00:32:01.99] - Laurie Kagay
Right.
[00:32:02.44] - Jeff Sherrod
So a kind of questions that I think you should ask is like, what does the average student pay out of pocket?
[00:32:08.25] - Laurie Kagay
Right?
[00:32:08.56] - Jeff Sherrod
Like, that's an appropriate question to ask.
[00:32:10.75] - Laurie Kagay
And how much debt do they carry?
[00:32:13.57] - Jeff Sherrod
How much debt do they carry after graduation? Exactly right? What is the average age package for students?
[00:32:20.10] - Laurie Kagay
What work options are available?
[00:32:21.26] - Jeff Sherrod
What work options are available? Like, really trying to come up with a plan for how you're going to graduate with either hopefully no debt or reasonable amount of debt, like at our college, we've made a commitment since we started that we don't want students to graduate with debt, which that means it takes a lot of financial literacy talks from both the really student and the parent.
[00:32:42.66] - Laurie Kagay
Right.
[00:32:42.93] - Jeff Sherrod
They both have to understand, like, what scholarships look like and how it works. And, you know, what is, how does their work supplement all this? And if they are working, what does that mean for their college studies? There's a lot of questions that need to go on, but make sure you're doing the hard work of really figuring that out. You're probably not. If you're a prospective student, you're not gonna be able to say, they're not gonna be able to give you the exact dollar amount. Right. But you can still push them for, well, what is average?
[00:33:09.56] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah, what's average?
[00:33:11.28] - Jeff Sherrod
A scholarship pack. What's the average student pay out of pocket? At least this is gonna give you a better idea of what this. What this is looking like.
[00:33:18.13] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah, I agree. I would say, like, if you're gonna make that investment to go and visit a campus, like, give it all you've got. Don't kind of be, like, a passive participant. Ask the questions, do the things. It's especially fun when people have done their research even before they come, and then they're kind of like, is the real. Does real life match what is being broadcast? Oh, so, yeah, on the website, like.
[00:33:43.10] - Jeff Sherrod
You'Ve already read it, but you're gonna ask them anyway and see if their answers line up. I like that.
[00:33:48.17] - Laurie Kagay
Like, sometimes they read our stuff. They're like, zero. Zero alumni have debt. They're like, is this real? Is this place real?
[00:33:55.34] - Jeff Sherrod
Right?
[00:33:55.61] - Laurie Kagay
Or they're like, you know, you have this many Bible classes and this much time. Is this real? Well, it obviously is, but ask. Yeah. Like, ask and ask the variety of people.
[00:34:04.93] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:34:05.76] - Laurie Kagay
Who you find and who you meet. And that really is. That's. That's the benefit of campus, is your campus visits, your. You're doing that fact finding mission.
[00:34:14.42] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:34:14.82] - Laurie Kagay
You're our, like, what we consider a successful campus visit is when a student knows what's next. That doesn't mean.
[00:34:21.21] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah, that's a good way of saying it. Right?
[00:34:22.96] - Laurie Kagay
Like, that doesn't mean they've chosen us sometimes we've had people come. They loved us online. They got here in person, and they were like, this is a lot. These are a lot of people talking to me. I'm not sure I can. I was doing number, and I'm like, yeah, you know, like, must not be the place for you.
[00:34:41.42] - Jeff Sherrod
Right?
[00:34:41.65] - Laurie Kagay
But, like, I counted as a success.
[00:34:43.53] - Jeff Sherrod
Because I'm exactly right.
[00:34:44.48] - Laurie Kagay
That was so much cheaper, so much faster than you enrolling here.
[00:34:48.07] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:34:48.65] - Laurie Kagay
Finding out a month in, two months in. I don't think this is the place.
[00:34:52.13] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:34:52.40] - Laurie Kagay
Like, and so, yeah, go for it. Now. It is a big decision, but, yeah. The goal at the end is for you to know, to feel confident in the Lord on your steps, whether that is the campus you're visiting or not.
[00:35:04.98] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah. And it's not. I think you're saying it right. It's. It's not about feeling comfortable with your next step. It's about feeling confident in the Lord. We're not just trying to be like, this would be the easiest place. Like, that's not a good.
[00:35:17.42] - Laurie Kagay
I wonder how Jesus would even handle anyone saying that.
[00:35:20.94] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah, Lord, I want to follow you and give me the easiest path.
[00:35:24.71] - Laurie Kagay
Yeah.
[00:35:25.40] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah. We don't get that. Instead. So, yeah, instead, I think it's good. Make the most of your college visit. Ask the hard questions. Ask a lot of people, you know, like, pray so you can be extroverted and you can show some kind of boldness, you know, even when you're there. Yeah, that's great. I know that a lot of. We're getting a lot of prospective students visiting right now. This is kind of a spring is very much a season of people taking these tours. So, yeah, I hope you guys were able to kind of work through some of this rubric. As you guys are doing tours this spring, I do encourage you to visit the school before you guys go there. I think it will make a big difference. And you guys making an informed decision about where you're going, you know, reach out, schedule it, see what, see how you can be accommodated, whether that's in a student preview day or a one off kind of visit. Until then, as always, we encourage you guys, and we love it when you do, when you like and subscribe to our channel. When you share with other people, it really means the world to us. See you guys next time.
[00:36:21.23] - Laurie Kagay
That's right. See you guys.